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- The Glory Story of Influence
This week, let’s step into the cinema of influence, and learn how great leaders use storytelling to spark transformative change. How do they flip the persuasive script to overcome resistance and align people with conflicting views? We might take a tip from a tail-wagging dog.
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THE ULLMEN INSIGHT
I worked with a leader at a tourism company who tried to persuade his CFO to adopt a much-needed improved Customer Relationship Management software system.
He presented compelling data and cost-benefit analyses. But the CFO said no. He’d seen plans that looked great on spreadsheets turn disastrous in practice.
What should the leader do?
Tell a story! Tell an influence story that adds more persuasive power to the rational reasons for the change you propose.
I call it a FROM-TO story.
Elements of a FROM-TO story
A FROM-TO story is a mental movie that vividly contrasts today’s reality with your desired “Influence Outcome.” Include these three elements in yours:
1. Paint Pictures: Use vivid “before & after” images or scenes to demonstrate the tangible value you’ll produce, and show how your Influence Outcome benefits key stakeholders.
Contrast the pains, costs or losses of the current state, with the savings or gains of your proposed improvements. Show how your solution solves their problem, and eliminates the obstacles they urgently need to overcome.
Application: The leader compiled a list of problems customers experience, with real-life examples of each one, e.g., pushy sales tactics, costly booking system failures, frustrating dietary needs errors, and insultingly ignored complaints.
2. Ignite Emotion: Choose “Before & After” images and scenes that evoke strong feelings. The current state should elicit frustration, anxiety, or anger, while the improved state should spark excitement, relief, or anticipation.
Application: The leader organized the problems into a nightmare story of a “Day in the LIfe” of a family of four. They eagerly anticipated their dream vacation, only to experience every single problem, one after the other, on a single, disastrous trip!
3. Link the Higher Why: Show how your Influence Outcome ties to the organization’s mission, core values, or strategic priorities. That enables stakeholders to unify above their team-level disputes to a larger, shared purpose. It also enhances your executive presence, positioning you as an advocate for enterprise-level interests, not just departmental agendas.
Application: In this case, the organization’s mission stressed customer-centricity. So the leader created an actual Before & After movie with actors, and shifted focus from a narrow focus on discouraging data to a broader core values catastrophe.
In the “Before” movie, the family experiences a comically terrible trip from beginning to end. It brought to painful life the human cost of what seemed to the CFO as mere data blips. Mom’s luggage gets lost, Dad gets sent to the wrong island, the kids get sick, and their dog looks sad.
The “After” movie showed a highlight reel of magic moments, where each mistake is replaced with personalized memorable experiences, and doggy wags his tail.
It worked! With the FROM-TO story, the executive reframed discouraging data as a CORE VALUES violation. It hit home with the CFO, who finally approved the leader’s solution.
Benefits of a FROM-TO story
A FROM-TO story is an indispensable asset for leaders who want to inspire, align, and win support for their initiatives. Here’s why:
1. All-In-One Impact: In one seamless arc, a FROM-TO story defines the problem (today’s reality), presents the solution (your proposed outcome), and showcases the payoff. It delivers a clear, unified case that stakeholders can easily grasp, regardless of their roles, expertise, or competing agendas. It distills complexity into a digestible, compelling message.
2. Memorable Edge: Data may fade, but stories stick. A well-crafted FROM-TO narrative keeps your Influence Outcome top-of-mind amid competing priorities. It’s not just heard, it’s remembered and retold.
3. Flexible Fit: The FROM-TO framework is remarkably versatile, adapting effortlessly to advance a wide range of initiatives, from projects and promotions to organizational changes. You can dial up the urgency, spotlight the value, or amplify the vision to suit your specific situation.
By vividly contrasting "what is" with "what could be," a FROM-TO story doesn’t just persuade, it galvanizes. It transforms your solution into a shared vision, rallying others to act with clarity, conviction, and a unified sense of purpose.
The best leaders know a FROM-TO story helps others go FROM “no” TO “yes,” from doubt to decision.
Data tells, but stories sell. Especially when your organization’s horror story becomes a feel-good adventure, and your stakeholders are the heroes.
The best leaders use mental movies to stir hearts, change minds, and spark action.
That’s the Insight: Go from gory to glory with a FROM-TO story.
Email John Ullmen to hire him to speak at your next event or for executive coaching.
THE ULLMEN TRIO
John holds an imagined conversation on our theme with this week’s guests, Geoffrey Chaucer and Nora Ephron.
Geoffrey Chaucer (c. 1343–1400):
His Canterbury Tales revolutionized English literature. He served in royal courts and wrote in Middle English, capturing raw, venal and sacred human nature with humor. Known as England’s first great poet.
Nora Ephron (1941–2012):
The wry, witty journalist and screenwriter, famous for When Harry Met Sally, Sleepless in Seattle and You’ve Got Mail. Her work blended humor with profound cultural commentary and insight on being a woman in a time of great cultural change.
Left: Geoffrey Chaucer (c. 1343–1400). Right: Nora Ephron (1941–2012).
 | John Ullmen, Host |
John Ullmen: Welcome, Geoffrey and Nora! It’s an absolute honor to have you both here. You’ve both taught me and have made me laugh out loud. Today, our listeners are eager leaders looking to improve their ability to connect, persuade, and inspire positive change. So I’d like to explore with you the power of storytelling in leadership. So, let me start with this: Can you tell me how important it is to you, as leaders in your respective fields, to use stories and storytelling to influence others effectively?
Geoffrey Chaucer: John, a pleasure it is to join this company and if you don’t mind, I’ll speak in Modern rather than Middle English! Yes! Story! A tale well-told stirs the blood and captures the imagination. Of course, naked commands may gain obedience for a time, but they seldom change a heart set stubbornly against you. A well crafted story, by contrast, finds its way past the ramparts of resistance and speaks directly to the soul.
I recall vividly, on that very pilgrimage road to Canterbury I wrote at length about, amidst the knights and millers and worldly wives, a humble clerk, quite unassuming, shared a story. Its theme, quite unexpected amidst the usual tales of chivalry or bawdiness, was simple patience and respect. It told how a learned man treated his wife.
And the impact it had! A nobleman in our company was visibly moved. Tears actually traced paths through the dust on his cheeks, and he admitted he'd never considered that kindness and empathy could accomplish more than fear or intimidation. He vowed, right there on the road, to return home and reevaluate how he governed his entire estate. In that moment, I truly grasped how a story can slip into the heart when direct orders fail, nudging a person to see the world anew, without feeling preached at…
Nora Ephron: Geoffrey, you’ve nailed it! It reminds me of a phrase my own mother, also a screenwriter, drilled into my sister Delia and me: “Everything is copy.” What she meant was that we can take our own experiences – especially the messy parts, the humiliations, the heartbreaks – and transform them into stories. And when we do that honestly, something magical happens: people see themselves reflected in our struggles and triumphs, they feel less alone, and suddenly, they become more open to change.
Want a real life example?
John: Of course! Tell us a story…
Great! When I was writing the screenplay that eventually became the movie Heartburn, I was drawing heavily on the very painful and public implosion of my marriage to Carl Bernstein. It was awful, frankly. But channeling that bitterness and betrayal into a story, finding the comedic, cautionary notes within it, was incredibly therapeutic for me, for starters.
More than that, I remember showing an early draft to a dear friend who felt utterly stuck, miserable in a toxic work environment she felt powerless to leave. Reading about my character Rachel's determination to reclaim her sense of self, even amidst the wreckage, struck a chord. She called me, her voice tremulous with newfound resolve, and said seeing my character fight back, finding humor even in the pain, gave her the courage to finally quit that job and find something healthier.
It struck me then with such force: the more personal and specific we dare to be in our stories, the more universally they connect. You're not just telling your story; you're holding up a mirror to their own hopes and fears. It invites them to rewrite their own ending alongside you. That’s persuasion born from empathy, not argument.
Geoffrey Chaucer: Nora, your courage in turning such personal pain into a story that empowered your friend is truly commendable. It can melt the frost in even the coldest or most resistant listener.
If fact, you remind me of a story, if I may. A bawdy one.
Nora Ephron: My favorite kind!
Geoffrey Chaucer: I recall an instance, quite different in tone but similar in effect, when I recited a rather bawdy yarn at the court of Richard II. Woven into the fabric of the jest, was a subtle mockery of vanity and excessive pride. Now, there was a certain woman present, known for her haughty airs, who clearly recognized herself in the vain character I described. To her credit, she laughed along with everyone else, perchance louder than most! But later, she confided in me privately that while laughing, she felt a sharp pang of realization. She admitted, rather sheepishly, that she'd been alienating her own family with her relentless arrogance. That small kernel of insight, planted by a humorous tale, actually led her to reconcile with her estranged sister not long after.
Nora Ephron: I wish I was there, Geoffrey – seeing how a spoonful of honey - I don’t think you had sugar in England yet, not to mention Sweet n’ Low - helps the medicine go down! Your courtier story is perfect. It reminds me of a scene from When Harry Met Sally... You know the one, the restaurant scene where Meg Ryan silences the place with her Big O. Sure, on the surface, it’s pure comedy, designed to get a big laugh. But underneath the performance, it’s really about our deep, often unspoken, human craving to be understood and accepted.
After the film came out, I received countless letters from people – men and women – who said that scene, funny as it was, actually encouraged them to be more honest and open in their own relationships! They realized, perhaps for the first time, that revealing your authentic self, even the quirky or embarrassing parts, could be both hilarious and profoundly healing. It doesn't have to be this heavy….
 | You can read the FULL interview in detail, with more questions and fascinating answers from each week's Trio guests! Coming soon, we'll offer Premium Membership in the Ullmen Leadership Academy to access the full interviews and much more. We're enthused to provide you more levels of access, to meet what works best for you. Stay tuned! |
THE TRIO TAKEAWAYS
 | 1. Serve Up Serious Truths with a Side of 'When Harry Met Sally' Comedy. Nora Ephron points out that seemingly pure comedy can carry profound messages about human connection and acceptance, like the iconic restaurant scene in When Harry Met Sally. The scene's humor made people feel comfortable enough to reflect on their own need for telling the truth in relationships. This reinforced for Ephron that stories don't need to be solemn to be transformative; relatable, funny moments effectively break down defenses, creating an opening for genuine persuasion born from shared experience, not argument. Application tip: When presenting challenging feedback or trying to build team cohesion, incorporate appropriate humor or share a funny, relatable anecdote that touches on the underlying theme (e.g., communication mishaps) to make the message more accessible and less intimidating. |
2. A Tale of Patience Can Bypass the Ramparts of Resistance. Geoffrey Chaucer highlights that direct commands might gain temporary obedience, but stories slip past defenses to change hearts. He recounts how a humble clerk's story about patience and respect profoundly moved a nobleman on the Canterbury pilgrimage, prompting a vow to change his leadership style. This nobleman, initially perhaps resistant to direct advice on kindness, was reached through the narrative, illustrating how stories can influence even hardened perspectives by speaking to the soul rather than demanding compliance. Stories gently nudge people to see things differently without making them feel lectured. Application tip: When facing resistance to a new process or idea, instead of just arguing the logic, share a brief story about someone (perhaps anonymized) who successfully navigated a similar challenge or embodies the value you're trying to instill. | 3. Turn Your Personal 'Heartburn' into Their Breakthrough Fuel. Nora Ephron emphasizes that turning your own messy experiences, even painful ones like the implosion of her marriage detailed in Heartburn, into stories makes them universally relatable. Sharing stories honestly allows others to see themselves in your struggles and triumphs, feeling less alone and becoming more open to change. Her friend found the courage to leave a toxic job after reading an early draft and seeing Ephron's character reclaim her sense of self, proving that personal specificity often creates the strongest universal connection. Application tip: When encouraging your team through a tough project or organizational change, share a relevant personal story about a time you faced a setback or felt vulnerable, and what you learned. This builds empathy and shows it's possible to navigate difficulty. |
4. Disarm with Laughter Like Chaucer’s Subtle Courtier Tale.
Geoffrey Chaucer shows how humor can deliver difficult truths in ways that giving lessons can’t. He shared a bawdy tale at court that subtly mocked vanity, causing a particular courtier known for her arrogance to recognize herself. While she laughed along publically, the story prompted a private realization that led her to reconcile with her estranged sister. This illustrates that stories, even lighthearted or comedic ones, can disarm defenses and plant seeds of insight more effectively than direct confrontation, offering a path forward without the sting.
Application tip: When needing to address a sensitive team dynamic or common counterproductive behavior (like resistance to feedback), use a lighthearted, relatable story (perhaps even self deprecating) that illustrates the point without directly targeting anyone.
Here are more titles of the takeaways I pulled from the extended conversation. I will make the full explanations of each one, and how to apply them, available separately…
5. Make Them Feel Wat the Weaver’s Trembling Hands to Grasp the Stakes.
Wat, a fictional weaver facing starvation takes a risky journey to save…
6. Pitch Your 'Sleepless in Seattle' Vision by Sharing Your Own Late Night Radio Moment.
Nora Ephron showed how personal vulnerability can sell a bold vision. Facing skepticism about the unconventional premise of Sleepless in Seattle, she told her own deeply personal story of hearing a stranger's vulnerable voice…
7. Build Trust Like Piers the Shipman: Let Your Story Mirror Their Truth.
Chaucer’s story of Piers, a shipman who suffered for his dishonesty but ultimately found greater prosperity through earned trust, captivated the cynical audience because…
8. Make 'You’ve Got Mail' Happen: Use Humor and Heart to Sell the New and Scary.
Nora Ephron explained how stories laced with humor and heart can make daunting changes feel urgent and achievable. Pitching You’ve Got Mail during the early, skeptical days of the internet, she countered producer doubts not with data, but with…
9. Develop Your Storytelling Muscle Through Vulnerable Practice and Hawk-Eyed Observation.
Nora Ephron advises developing storytelling skills by sharing… she honed the painful story of Heartburn by first sharing parts with friends, watching their reactions to gauge emotional truth. Simultaneously, she constantly gathered raw material by eavesdropping and…
10. Seek Out Boccaccio and Test Your Tales in the ‘Tabard Inn’ of Your World.
Geoffrey Chaucer emphasizes enriching your storytelling by testing your own work with real audiences. His exposure to Boccaccio in Italy inspired the idea of The Canterbury Tales which he then tested by reading them in London inns, learning directly from the crowd's …
11. Embrace Your ‘This Is My Life’ Flops as Brutally Honest Teachers.
Nora Ephron learned the hard way, with her directorial debut This Is My Life, that failure is an essential teacher. When the initial cut felt flat and preachy, she leaned into the failure, and chose to amplify…
12. Live Amongst Your ‘Plowmen’ and Empower Others to Retell the Tale.
While serving as a respected Justice of the Peace in Kent during turbulent times, Chaucer shifted opinions by telling a simple, moving story about a generous plowman, then taught…
13. Build Bridges to the Future with Edwin the Stonemason’s Love-Infused Craft.
Facing conflict between masons and monks at Westminster Abbey, Chaucer told the story of Edwin, a stonemason who carved a gargoyle out of…
14. Surprise Them with the Joy of a Burnt Boeuf Bourguignon Moment.
Nora Ephron used joy to break through cynicism and foster connection, sharing with her film crew her own disastrous…
15. Let the Fox Trip Over His Tail: Use Good Natured Humor to Disarm Fear.
During the Peasants' Revolt, facing a panicked guildhall, Chaucer told a simple, funny story about an arrogant fox outsmarted by…
16. Channel Your Inner Phoebe Ephron: Deliver Defiance with Fiery Brevity.
In her Wellesley commencement address, Nora Ephron recalled her Mother’s pithy, "If it’s not worth doing, don’t do it!" Rather than a long…
Final Thought:
Mastering leadership storytelling isn't about becoming a performer; it's about deepening your connection to your own experiences and to the people you lead. As Geoffrey Chaucer and Nora Ephron so vividly illustrate, weaving vulnerability, observation, humor, and heart into your narratives allows you to build bridges, inspire action, and paint compelling visions that others genuinely want to follow. Embrace the process, practice consistently, and trust that your authentic stories hold the power to shape a better future together.
Email John Ullmen to hire him to speak at your next event or for executive coaching.
THE TRIPLE PLAY
Great leaders grow their understanding of people by exploring similarities, differences, and possibilities. Let’s practice this skill each week, with inspiration from our Trio guests.
1. COMPARE: Something they share.
They Revolutionized Storytelling
Chaucer not only broke ground by writing in Middle English (opening the door for common folk to understand and enjoy literature), but he also experimented with form and voice in ways that had never been done before, giving each pilgrim in The Canterbury Tales a distinct personality. By doing so, he demonstrated that literature could be both accessible and artistically rich, influencing countless writers in the centuries after him.
Ephron, for her part, shattered norms in her own time by blending journalistic candor with a personal, almost intimate style, proving that real-life anecdotes and confessional humor could resonate powerfully with broad audiences. She showed that everyday moments, when written with wit and insight, could become the backbone of popular films and best-selling essays, blurring the line between high art and mass entertainment.
2. CONTRAST: Something they see differently.
On the Nature of Humor
Chaucer’s View: Medieval humor thrived on slapstick, situational irony, and poking fun at class or religious figures in a coded way. Chaucer used humor to highlight human folly while also weaving in moral or spiritual lessons beneath the laughs.
Ephron’s Counterpoint: Ephron’s humor was frequently urban, cerebral, and conversation-driven. She embraced witty one-liners, fast-paced banter, and intimate revelations that turned everyday neuroses into comedic gold—less moralistic, more confessional.
3. CREATE: Something they might innovate.
To help us exercise our own leadership creativity, here we imagine the guests were alive today and joined forces to create something new.
I’ll share one of my favorites next week, and I welcome yours in the meantime!
Last week our guests were I. M. Pei (1917–2019) and Eleanor Roosevelt (1884-1962), and this could be one of theirs:
 |
The “Bridging Ideas” Footbridge
A functional yet symbolic pedestrian bridge in a major city, designed by Pei with glass panes and geometric steel beams. Near the entrance, Eleanor’s quotes encourage passersby to reflect on building connections (literal and metaphorical) between people of different backgrounds.
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John